IDEA: Item Exchange for Retired Items

In Colonial America, the colonists relied exclusively on bartering for their goods and services. I thought of a cute idea that I believe will not only revitalize Colonial Age and the VFK economy, but will also draw old players back to the game and keep mini-game rooms busy year-round: If Mr.Clutter opened up a barter shop in Colonial Age for users to exchange five (5) of their active Quest, Mini-Quest, Scavenger Hunt, or Mini-Game Prizes for one (1) random retired item in the respective category. This idea is very similar to our seasonal furni-exchange.

With well over a decade of items to interact with, it can be pretty intimidating joining as a new player, with no viable means of acquiring older items beyond Antique Shop events. Even older players, who have the virtual financial means, find difficulty in hunting down particular items -- pieces of retired game costumes, game furnish, game FX, quest items, or scavenger hunt prizes. What I am proposing is a method by which a newer player (or any player) can put in a considerable amount of effort and time to acquire active items, exchanging these items for a random retired item of the same variety.

So if, for example, I were to exchange any combination of five game shoes, currently the active game prize, I could potentially win a Super Dario or Princess Apricot costume piece. Or if I were to exchange five Icicle Storm Enchantments, currently the active game FX, I would have a chance at winning one random retired game FX.

Since the prize pools for each category are quite extensive, the probability of winning a particular item are slim. With over 520 quest items, the probability of winning a particular quest item would be less than two-tenths of a percent (<0.2% or 0.002), so the drawing will be a complete surprise each time, and no one item will deflate in value. This will keep the exchange fun and interesting because players will never know what they are going to get. As a result, active items will be more desirable, even if players aren't a fan of the item itself. Players will be more active so they can acquire these new releases, in an effort to exchange for something greater, or for an item they might have missed.

The whole idea is to re-introduce older, hard-to-find items in a way that doesn't damage their value, by making the player put in a significant amount of effort and time for a CHANCE at winning big. Not every exchange will be profitable, and in fact some will be rather costly (imagine exchanging five Icicle Storm FX and receiving one Shooting Stars FX). Additionally, since the items being exchanged are valuable in and of themselves, the retired item will still come at a price. I believe five items is a fair amount since for every game magic a player earns, they will earn six additional game prizes, which they can then exchange for one retired game prize. In my opinion, any more than one retired item per FX would be too excessive.

To address concerns of potential deflation and market destabilization, I would recommend excluding beta quest items from the quest item pool (anything before the first gamma quest, VFK Western Frontier Quest -- July 27, 2008), since these are the items upon which our trading system is based. I would also recommend introducing an exchange cap, similar to the seasonal furni-exchange, except much lower. Lastly, since pumpkin enchantments need the additional requirement of escaping the headless horseman/alligators, I would suggest old pumpkin enchantments would only be available during the month of October, when a new pumpkin enchantment is active.

I would love to hear any comments or critiques you have regarding this idea. I think it would be particularly funny if Mr.Clutter (who we know is a ghost), tended the barter shop, since he would be accepting items during Colonial times, and selling them back during Retro times (no wonder he has so many antiques!). Let me know what you think!

Comments

  • edited February 6
    Ok so, I think this is a great idea. A big problem right now is not being able to find old items, especially items between 2014-2015. And even though the odds are slim.. it would still be exciting to trade in 5 scavengers and receive a 2015 scavenger, if I'm lucky. Also, Leaving out host hunt/event prizes and lamps is a great too...
    I think that it should only be for scavenger, quest, mini quest, game magics, and game prizes. If host prizes were included it would just get confusing. Most people only get in a host room about twice, so we'd end up throwing away more host prizes than we're gaining. Same for lamps. The loss would outweigh the gain. However, with quests, scavenger, etc(What I mentioned before) it's perfect because it allows people the opportunity to hustle and decide if it's worth it to attempt to exchange for a rarer prize.
    For example, this scavenger.. the heart pin is great! I probably wouldn't want to exchange that. But that neon sign from the other week I hated and I didn't do any quests. If Tom's idea was an option..I'd probably do a bunch of the quests just to exchange! It not only gives something to do at all time, but it also helps us find items that we didn't even know existed, or forgot about.
    I don't see any cons to this... The amount of items in VFK would allow for this to be beneficial and the chances of getting a specific item would be so low that it would not affect values. It would bring more items back into the game; especially since there's hundreds of old players with old items sitting on their accounts that they don't play anymore. As for new players, it is very difficult to start out with nothing on here. If I joined, I'd probably quit within the week because I wouldn't know how to work my way up. With this option, it gives new players the opportunity to grow their accounts. And us old players something to do and a chance to find items we may have missed through the years.

    I think it's a great idea,
    and that building left to the ship of colonial age would be the perfect place to put the shop! It would be a great feature that could help bring new and old players back! I hope others agree and VFK decides to implement this.
  • edited February 6
    NiceCutePumpkin said:

    Ok so, I think this is a great idea. A big problem right now is not being able to find old items, especially items between 2014-2015. And even though the odds are slim.. it would still be exciting to trade in 5 scavengers and received a 2015 scavenger, if I'm lucky. Also, Leaving out host hunt/event prizes and lamps is a great too...

    I think that it should only be for scavenger, quest, mini quest, game magics, and game prizes. If host prizes were included it would just get confusing. Most people only get in a host room about twice, so we'd end up throwing away more host prizes than we're gaining. Same for lamps. The loss would outweigh the gain. However, with quests, scavenger, etc(What I mentioned before) it's perfect because it allows people the opportunity to hustle and decide if it's worth it to attempt to exchange for a rarer prize.
    For example, this scavenger.. the heart pin is great! I probably wouldn't want to exchange that. But that neon sign from the other week I hated and I didn't do any quests. If Tom's idea was an option..I'd probably do a bunch of the quests just to exchange! It not only gives something to do at all time, but it also helps us find items that we didn't even know existed, or forgot about.
    I don't see any cons to this... The amount of items in VFK would allow for this to be beneficial and the chances of getting a specific item would be so low that it would not affect values. It would bring more items back into the game; especially since there's hundreds of old players with old items sitting on their accounts that they don't play anymore. As for new players, it is very difficult to start out with nothing on here. If I joined, I'd probably quit within the week because I wouldn't know how to work my way up. With this option, it gives new players the opportunity to grow their accounts. And us old players something to do and a chance to find items we may have missed through the years.

    I think it's a great idea,
    and that building left to the ship of colonial age would be the perfect place to put the shop! It would be a great feature that could help bring new and old players back! I hope others agree and VFK decides to implement this.
    i agree also and i think  The store should be open at night bc Mr.Clutter is a ghost
  • edited February 6
    not only that idea would be great, but this idea would slowly release older items into the game while preserving their value.
  • Tomorrow said:

    In Colonial America, the colonists relied exclusively on bartering for their goods and services. I thought of a cute idea that I believe will not only revitalize Colonial Age and the VFK economy, but will also draw old players back to the game and keep mini-game rooms busy year-round: If Mr.Clutter opened up a barter shop in Colonial Age for users to exchange five (5) of their active Quest, Mini-Quest, Scavenger Hunt, or Mini-Game Prizes for one (1) random retired item in the respective category. This idea is very similar to our seasonal furni-exchange.


    With well over a decade of items to interact with, it can be pretty intimidating joining as a new player, with no viable means of acquiring older items beyond Antique Shop events. Even older players, who have the virtual financial means, find difficulty in hunting down particular items -- pieces of retired game costumes, game furnish, game FX, quest items, or scavenger hunt prizes. What I am proposing is a method by which a newer player (or any player) can put in a considerable amount of effort and time to acquire active items, exchanging these items for a random retired item of the same variety.

    So if, for example, I were to exchange any combination of five game shoes, currently the active game prize, I could potentially win a Super Dario or Princess Apricot costume piece. Or if I were to exchange five Icicle Storm Enchantments, currently the active game FX, I would have a chance at winning one random retired game FX.

    Since the prize pools for each category are quite extensive, the probability of winning a particular item are slim. With over 520 quest items, the probability of winning a particular quest item would be less than two-tenths of a percent (<0.2% or 0.002), so the drawing will be a complete surprise each time, and no one item will deflate in value. This will keep the exchange fun and interesting because players will never know what they are going to get. As a result, active items will be more desirable, even if players aren't a fan of the item itself. Players will be more active so they can acquire these new releases, in an effort to exchange for something greater, or for an item they might have missed.

    The whole idea is to re-introduce older, hard-to-find items in a way that doesn't damage their value, by making the player put in a significant amount of effort and time for a CHANCE at winning big. Not every exchange will be profitable, and in fact some will be rather costly (imagine exchanging five Icicle Storm FX and receiving one Shooting Stars FX). Additionally, since the items being exchanged are valuable in and of themselves, the retired item will still come at a price. I believe five items is a fair amount since for every game magic a player earns, they will earn six additional game prizes, which they can then exchange for one retired game prize. In my opinion, any more than one retired item per FX would be too excessive.

    To address concerns of potential deflation and market destabilization, I would recommend excluding beta quest items from the quest item pool (anything before the first gamma quest, VFK Western Frontier Quest -- July 27, 2008), since these are the items upon which our trading system is based. I would also recommend introducing an exchange cap, similar to the seasonal furni-exchange, except much lower. Lastly, since pumpkin enchantments need the additional requirement of escaping the headless horseman/alligators, I would suggest old pumpkin enchantments would only be available during the month of October, when a new pumpkin enchantment is active.

    I would love to hear any comments or critiques you have regarding this idea. I think it would be particularly funny if Mr.Clutter (who we know is a ghost), tended the barter shop, since he would be accepting items during Colonial times, and selling them back during Retro times (no wonder he has so many antiques!). Let me know what you think!
    Also  i guess that can be Mr.clutter back story and how the antique shop happen XD
  • edited February 6
    I don't usually comment on posts like this because the person normally wants to get rare items really easily because they are tired of looking and trading can be a hassle.  

    However, it looks like you put a lot of thought into this @tomorrow and considered the fact that older players wouldn't want to have their hard earned items (even if they don't trade them) devalued by introducing too many additional copies of them. Because if you were there when the item was new and got it, then you have a part of your life in that item and time is money so in a sense the item has a real value (Might sound silly but I think it's true)  I also don't think anyone would object to someone getting retired items, provided they worked for them as hard as they might have to if they were going to trade for them!

    Keeping beta items out of it is brilliant because, as you said, they are what our value system is based upon and it would be terrible to have that undermined!

    This is a very moderate proposal and well thought out.  I support this and if VFK Staff look at it I add my vote!

    Bravo and well done Tomorrow!  =D>

    P.S just a little back story on Mr Clutter, he is Esmeralda's (Halloween shop girl) Uncle and they are both (I'm pretty sure) Gypsies and fortune tellers which would mean they travel a great deal and are interested in oddities!  As you may notice Esmeralda can disappear entirely but her Uncle can only disappear himself but not his clothes, adding a mystifying element which all good gypsies should possess!  I've never heard anything about them being ghosts but since they only come around at Halloween (And Esmeralda at Easter) nothing says they can't be ghost gypsies which would be doubly neat!!

    I also think that the Antique fortune teller "Maleva The Magnificent" is related somehow, maybe since it is a mechanical fortune teller it is based off a real person such as a sister or cousin of Esmeralda!  This hasn't been confirmed but I like to think it!

    This is long o.o


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    thank you dazzlerdream for the signature
  • This idea is wonderful and so well-thought out, you have my vote for it, too! :) I really hope this is something the VFK Staff put into consideration.
  • I hope we get more ares for colonial age soon. I really want more of that age, it's so pretty. I hope they consider adding your idea to one of those empty buildings. I'm sure a lot of people whould be willing to try it. 
    cutelina
  • I really think this idea is awesome.  It would get the trading market back into the game as well as getting people to be more active!! I think it's an awesome idea! 
  • I love it, it's a great idea!! Plus it'll be a great addition to the Colonial age, it's definitely gonna boost up that age!! 
                                                     tumblr_ovvwpyD5ik1s9fxalo1_500
  • I think this is a fantastic idea... and while this is being mentioned, I do recall VFK coming up with some kind of trading reward system a few years ago. It was something along the lines of... "if you traded for a certain retired item, you would get "points" (like the contest boutique) towards a new exclusive item"... I believe your method mentioned + the old mock up idea for this trading reward system would definitely bring back some of those full to the brim trade rooms that we all know, love, and miss!


    5
  • edited February 7
    It’s a clever idea, however I don’t think it’s wise to put retired items back in game. I think it would make trade value go down for certain items as they slowly, but surely, become more commonly found. (despite the argument that it wouldn’t, I politely disagree.)

    People work hard to trade for/ or earn in the past, retired items. I think that work would be invalidated by this system.

    This is only my opinion, and I don’t discredit your clever ideas. I do acknowledge it is a smart and cool concept, just not something I necessarily agree with.

    Quick additional note: I agree with Pumpkin on the aspect of this being a thing done with only quest/scavenger items. Game items sound fun too, but those can go for a lot (particularly the costumes and fx) and I wouldn’t want the value going down on those.

    If this were done only with quest and scavenger items, no host/game stuff, I’d be on board with the idea.
  • edited February 8
    This is a well constructed post and you've explained your points very well!

    I had a different idea back in 2018 when I wrote about a possible Colonial Barter Trade area in Colonial age. This was due to a large amount of things we got inside the colonial boxes, barrels and even more unnecessary items inside the ship hatch. There were even more items we got from Survival Month - November 2017 when we planted survival corn and since Survival Month focused greatly in the Colonial Age I thought we could do some bartering there. See pictures below. 

    But I can clearly tell that this isn't the case now since most of us used those items for furni exchange last couple halloween(s) especially me. I got rid of most of them and even sold them in my closet. I did kept some for building as well but for the most part, I just parted with them. 

    I've also wanted another adventure mission much like Space Merchants because I believe it will draw traffic, engage players to another realm of history, and keep the momentum going there with another exciting mission with new prizes! Aceboy_Alex suggested to format the adventure like the game "Oregon Trail". Maybe we can use messenger birds, or ocean bottles with messages inside as the items to carry out the adventure. See pictures below.

    I'm 50/50 on this but a mock trial would be highly recommended to see if this can work. I'm quite new-ish/old-ish (almost 2 years playing) but I can say for myself that getting rare items the hard way is my preferred way of trading. You might ask why, well its just my nature & it feels much more fulfilling (annoying but fulfilling in the end). I don't like getting things the easy way I guess although you clearly said it won't be easy and the level of acquiring would be equal to the past item. I agree on the fairness of the FX/costume part. I'm talking about those in-demand rare items and not retired quest items and I know you also mentioned them above.
     
    Or in most cases if I can't really acquire a "rare" item, I just shrug it off, move on and hoard the current, present and even future items (which is partly why I suggest and enjoy seeing people suggesting so I can know which is worth hoarding for my game time) and partially convince myself that I would eventually get what I want in the future. I might need some old walls though and that's why I'm leaning 50/50. 

    The concept is good. The execution however is another story. Would this really make trading great again? How about those who doesn't trade? Will it convert them to be traders or not since they can just get rarer or retired items without actually trading with another person? 

    I'm interested in the part how you said this will bring old players back in. I'm pretty sure most of them are still nostalgic about the older items but is there a way to contact the majority of them? Maybe staff can send a mass email for this? I also have so many questions regarding as how the VFK staff will make this happen. Will it affect the coding? Will it mess up the releasing system? I'm not a developer nor a coder but I wonder about these things. I see VFK as a constantly developing game and so that makes it a "come and go" kind of game with an endless array of items that releases in different timings. It's like the saying, "You can't step in the same river twice." So like VFK, it just constantly develop and when a person plays they earn things for that time being and of course they can trade for older things if they want for that time being as well.

    Another question would be if they implemented this, how long will it run? Will it be seasonally like Antique Shop? You said destabilization won't be an issue but I want to know where you draw the line? There are hundreds of items they release in a year, how will the picking for this and that would go? I have more follow up questions about this but I'll stop right here.

    Furthermore about the new players, I have yet to meet more people like me who is passionate & active about each & every old stuff (which I do collect for building mostly & for collecting purposes). I have over 50 rooms with different themed collection. Ask any of my friends who have seen them and they'll tell you its crazy.. I do am actively collecting with a friend who is also a newbie.

    But for the most parts, my friends who joined in the past couple years as I did, don't look much for older stuff. And if they do, it would be clothing more than furni, pins or FX. We tend to stick to current items and much rather hoard them on a general level. When I was new as well, I didn't really collect. The collecting happened months later when I keep seeing Puzzle Lamps room on popular rooms etc. To engage in a collection mode, a new player must play and interact a lot with older players and to really immerse in this game to find the beauty in these pixel items enough to start collecting them. That's what I think. I personally think my love for building competition boosted this as well. 

    Majority of the traders in trade rooms are older players versus new players. And majority who commented on this are as well. If you are newish, I would like to hear your side! I would like to see VFK economy get better but at the same time I think when they introduced Antique Shop, it did answer for it as I can see some old players getting angel shoes and beanies (they have missed out on) for their antique items. With my own transactions as well, I acquired older items depending on the season and the person but generally yes, the antique has helped a lot. 

    I'm all for updating Colonial Age - make it fun and thriving there. And if I sound doubtful its because in real I tend to be a skeptic sometimes and run questions in my mind to have a broader scope of things before jumping into conclusions if you get my drift. :)

    P.S. I think placing Mr. Clutter there would be amazing. Or another counter-part of him... Like they could be competitors in the merchant world. :)


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  • edited February 10
    Perpetual_Fighter said:

    It’s a clever idea, however I don’t think it’s wise to put retired items back in game. I think it would make trade value go down for certain items as they slowly, but surely, become more commonly found. (despite the argument that it wouldn’t, I politely disagree.)

    People work hard to trade for/ or earn in the past, retired items. I think that work would be invalidated by this system.

    This is only my opinion, and I don’t discredit your clever ideas. I do acknowledge it is a smart and cool concept, just not something I necessarily agree with.

    Quick additional note: I agree with Pumpkin on the aspect of this being a thing done with only quest/scavenger items. Game items sound fun too, but those can go for a lot (particularly the costumes and fx) and I wouldn’t want the value going down on those.

    If this were done only with quest and scavenger items, no host/game stuff, I’d be on board with the idea.

    I actually think that costumes and fx wouldn't be a bad idea at all. I was totally off on the idea at first too when Tom explained it to me because I said exactly what you said; especially with magics in particular. Because I don't want the value to go down.. but.. Something to keep in mind.. the number of items to exchange would be set at 5... and it's also only for CURRENT magics. So you can't go and exchange old magics that you just don't use. So for a current example.. I'd have to win 5 icicle magics just to be able to exchange anything. I usually can only win 2 magics before I'm losing my mind, personally lol. BUT.. I think because of the amount required - it's not like Everyone would be running out to exchange magics. I actually think it would help raise the price of the current magic. I currently won and icicle and sold it for 300k. If more people were looking for current magics because they wanted to exchange - it would bring more people out to game, and it would raise the price of current magics. Which I think need to be raised. 300k isn't enough for the hours spent gaming. But also... It's important to keep in mind that there's more magics than I can even mention... and those 2014-2015 years are so scarce. Your chances of winning one magic in particular is extremely slim. Because of the amount of work required to put in to win a magic.. there wouldn't be enough exchanges for it to have any effect. Tom, for example, has spent the past like, 2 years I believe? trying to find all of the game magics. It's a LOT harder than it should be because players have quit and people just don't have them. So for one magic in particular, let's say sniki-tiki cause I know he had trouble with that one, the odds of winning it are so slim... The amount released in a month probably wouldn't even exceed 5. The odds are just so small and the hard work for the magic limits the frequency and amount of people who would be doing the fx exchange.

    NOW.. haha; on the topic of game pieces and costumes. Another thing to mention; it takes 6 games ? I think, to win a magic. So that is only one exchange per game magic. So you make the exchange.. there are SO many game prizes out there. You can get a night fight chair, you can get raggedy ann shoes; endless possibilities. But it's only ONE piece. Not the entire costume. So again, because of the amount of hard work it takes to get current game prizes; the average person probably wouldn't exceed 1-2 exchanges in this category a month. I mean, when was the last time you gamed? I haven't played anything since.... uh I think last month lol. And I only won one game prize. I think it would be a lot different if we were to release the whole costume! But because the odds are so slim and you could literally get a skirt, which holds little value; it also really would have no effect on values. That was really the reasoning behind keeping it at 5. If it was a low number like only needing 2 then yea that would be ridiculous because people would be doing exchanges like mad. The amount of time it takes to win these prizes, makes it so you physically can't do as many exchanges as you might want to. It's just so tedious so, it's funny to because I'd probably be so mad if I spent all the time to win 5 game prizes.. only to exchange it for a night fighter chair. But that risk is a big part of this, which makes it fun!

    ALSO- Totally agree on the host thing, host should not be included in this. That for sure would mess up values and just get very confusing. But game prizes and fx I have no problem with due to the amount of work that's necessary.
    Sorry this was so long btw LOL. I just didn't wanna say it wrong and have you misinterpret. I think this could be a really great idea for vfk just to get items back out there, even if its only one or two. Our item count is so slim, fx especially. I don't know if it will have this Huge effect on vfk but it would be helpful and definitely give something to do on the slow weeks when we have no events.
    If you still disagree that's totally fine, I just figured I'd help explain a little because.. When tom first said it to me .. we basically went back and forth for a good 20 minutes of me saying exactly what you just said lol.
  • I finally had the time to sit down and read this. I really like this idea. There are some things I'm not a fond of when it comes to quests and scavengers, and I could trade off whatever I got in the exchange just in case someone else needs it and they may not end up getting it. I think that's fair.

    I'm happy there's no host in it, however what about maze items?(both the small prizes such as the fences and the big prize) You can bulk up on those two and exchange for them. If they were left out intentionally I'd like to know; some people collect these though so I was curious.
    art-starbucks 
  • NiceCutePumpkin said:

    Perpetual_Fighter said:

    It’s a clever idea, however I don’t think it’s wise to put retired items back in game. I think it would make trade value go down for certain items as they slowly, but surely, become more commonly found. (despite the argument that it wouldn’t, I politely disagree.)

    People work hard to trade for/ or earn in the past, retired items. I think that work would be invalidated by this system.

    This is only my opinion, and I don’t discredit your clever ideas. I do acknowledge it is a smart and cool concept, just not something I necessarily agree with.

    Quick additional note: I agree with Pumpkin on the aspect of this being a thing done with only quest/scavenger items. Game items sound fun too, but those can go for a lot (particularly the costumes and fx) and I wouldn’t want the value going down on those.

    If this were done only with quest and scavenger items, no host/game stuff, I’d be on board with the idea.

    I actually think that costumes and fx wouldn't be a bad idea at all. I was totally off on the idea at first too when Tom explained it to me because I said exactly what you said; especially with magics in particular. Because I don't want the value to go down.. but.. Something to keep in mind.. the number of items to exchange would be set at 5... and it's also only for CURRENT magics. So you can't go and exchange old magics that you just don't use. So for a current example.. I'd have to win 5 icicle magics just to be able to exchange anything. I usually can only win 2 magics before I'm losing my mind, personally lol. BUT.. I think because of the amount required - it's not like Everyone would be running out to exchange magics. I actually think it would help raise the price of the current magic. I currently won and icicle and sold it for 300k. If more people were looking for current magics because they wanted to exchange - it would bring more people out to game, and it would raise the price of current magics. Which I think need to be raised. 300k isn't enough for the hours spent gaming. But also... It's important to keep in mind that there's more magics than I can even mention... and those 2014-2015 years are so scarce. Your chances of winning one magic in particular is extremely slim. Because of the amount of work required to put in to win a magic.. there wouldn't be enough exchanges for it to have any effect. Tom, for example, has spent the past like, 2 years I believe? trying to find all of the game magics. It's a LOT harder than it should be because players have quit and people just don't have them. So for one magic in particular, let's say sniki-tiki cause I know he had trouble with that one, the odds of winning it are so slim... The amount released in a month probably wouldn't even exceed 5. The odds are just so small and the hard work for the magic limits the frequency and amount of people who would be doing the fx exchange.

    NOW.. haha; on the topic of game pieces and costumes. Another thing to mention; it takes 6 games ? I think, to win a magic. So that is only one exchange per game magic. So you make the exchange.. there are SO many game prizes out there. You can get a night fight chair, you can get raggedy ann shoes; endless possibilities. But it's only ONE piece. Not the entire costume. So again, because of the amount of hard work it takes to get current game prizes; the average person probably wouldn't exceed 1-2 exchanges in this category a month. I mean, when was the last time you gamed? I haven't played anything since.... uh I think last month lol. And I only won one game prize. I think it would be a lot different if we were to release the whole costume! But because the odds are so slim and you could literally get a skirt, which holds little value; it also really would have no effect on values. That was really the reasoning behind keeping it at 5. If it was a low number like only needing 2 then yea that would be ridiculous because people would be doing exchanges like mad. The amount of time it takes to win these prizes, makes it so you physically can't do as many exchanges as you might want to. It's just so tedious so, it's funny to because I'd probably be so mad if I spent all the time to win 5 game prizes.. only to exchange it for a night fighter chair. But that risk is a big part of this, which makes it fun!

    ALSO- Totally agree on the host thing, host should not be included in this. That for sure would mess up values and just get very confusing. But game prizes and fx I have no problem with due to the amount of work that's necessary.
    Sorry this was so long btw LOL. I just didn't wanna say it wrong and have you misinterpret. I think this could be a really great idea for vfk just to get items back out there, even if its only one or two. Our item count is so slim, fx especially. I don't know if it will have this Huge effect on vfk but it would be helpful and definitely give something to do on the slow weeks when we have no events.
    If you still disagree that's totally fine, I just figured I'd help explain a little because.. When tom first said it to me .. we basically went back and forth for a good 20
    minutes of me saying exactly what you just said lol.
    First and foremost, thank you so much for taking the time to explain this clearly and thoroughly. I appreciate the effort of mapping everything out in a concise manner. That being said, I have to say I am convinced. You’re right, that would make it pretty difficult to find a full costume or fx with other items involved in the draw like night fighter chairs lol. I am on the hunt for a couple night fighter bottles, so maybe this could be my chance to either trade for one or obtain one myself. Chances are still very slim, but it’s better than 0.

    Anyways, I can say now that I’m on board with this idea involving game prizes as well. The only thing I don’t want involved are antiques and host items. Besides that, I’m alright with everything else. :)
  • Perpetual_Fighter said:

    NiceCutePumpkin said:

    Perpetual_Fighter said:

    It’s a clever idea, however I don’t think it’s wise to put retired items back in game. I think it would make trade value go down for certain items as they slowly, but surely, become more commonly found. (despite the argument that it wouldn’t, I politely disagree.)

    People work hard to trade for/ or earn in the past, retired items. I think that work would be invalidated by this system.

    This is only my opinion, and I don’t discredit your clever ideas. I do acknowledge it is a smart and cool concept, just not something I necessarily agree with.

    Quick additional note: I agree with Pumpkin on the aspect of this being a thing done with only quest/scavenger items. Game items sound fun too, but those can go for a lot (particularly the costumes and fx) and I wouldn’t want the value going down on those.

    If this were done only with quest and scavenger items, no host/game stuff, I’d be on board with the idea.

    I actually think that costumes and fx wouldn't be a bad idea at all. I was totally off on the idea at first too when Tom explained it to me because I said exactly what you said; especially with magics in particular. Because I don't want the value to go down.. but.. Something to keep in mind.. the number of items to exchange would be set at 5... and it's also only for CURRENT magics. So you can't go and exchange old magics that you just don't use. So for a current example.. I'd have to win 5 icicle magics just to be able to exchange anything. I usually can only win 2 magics before I'm losing my mind, personally lol. BUT.. I think because of the amount required - it's not like Everyone would be running out to exchange magics. I actually think it would help raise the price of the current magic. I currently won and icicle and sold it for 300k. If more people were looking for current magics because they wanted to exchange - it would bring more people out to game, and it would raise the price of current magics. Which I think need to be raised. 300k isn't enough for the hours spent gaming. But also... It's important to keep in mind that there's more magics than I can even mention... and those 2014-2015 years are so scarce. Your chances of winning one magic in particular is extremely slim. Because of the amount of work required to put in to win a magic.. there wouldn't be enough exchanges for it to have any effect. Tom, for example, has spent the past like, 2 years I believe? trying to find all of the game magics. It's a LOT harder than it should be because players have quit and people just don't have them. So for one magic in particular, let's say sniki-tiki cause I know he had trouble with that one, the odds of winning it are so slim... The amount released in a month probably wouldn't even exceed 5. The odds are just so small and the hard work for the magic limits the frequency and amount of people who would be doing the fx exchange.

    NOW.. haha; on the topic of game pieces and costumes. Another thing to mention; it takes 6 games ? I think, to win a magic. So that is only one exchange per game magic. So you make the exchange.. there are SO many game prizes out there. You can get a night fight chair, you can get raggedy ann shoes; endless possibilities. But it's only ONE piece. Not the entire costume. So again, because of the amount of hard work it takes to get current game prizes; the average person probably wouldn't exceed 1-2 exchanges in this category a month. I mean, when was the last time you gamed? I haven't played anything since.... uh I think last month lol. And I only won one game prize. I think it would be a lot different if we were to release the whole costume! But because the odds are so slim and you could literally get a skirt, which holds little value; it also really would have no effect on values. That was really the reasoning behind keeping it at 5. If it was a low number like only needing 2 then yea that would be ridiculous because people would be doing exchanges like mad. The amount of time it takes to win these prizes, makes it so you physically can't do as many exchanges as you might want to. It's just so tedious so, it's funny to because I'd probably be so mad if I spent all the time to win 5 game prizes.. only to exchange it for a night fighter chair. But that risk is a big part of this, which makes it fun!

    ALSO- Totally agree on the host thing, host should not be included in this. That for sure would mess up values and just get very confusing. But game prizes and fx I have no problem with due to the amount of work that's necessary.
    Sorry this was so long btw LOL. I just didn't wanna say it wrong and have you misinterpret. I think this could be a really great idea for vfk just to get items back out there, even if its only one or two. Our item count is so slim, fx especially. I don't know if it will have this Huge effect on vfk but it would be helpful and definitely give something to do on the slow weeks when we have no events.
    If you still disagree that's totally fine, I just figured I'd help explain a little because.. When tom first said it to me .. we basically went back and forth for a good 20
    minutes of me saying exactly what you just said lol.
    First and foremost, thank you so much for taking the time to explain this clearly and thoroughly. I appreciate the effort of mapping everything out in a concise manner. That being said, I have to say I am convinced. You’re right, that would make it pretty difficult to find a full costume or fx with other items involved in the draw like night fighter chairs lol. I am on the hunt for a couple night fighter bottles, so maybe this could be my chance to either trade for one or obtain one myself. Chances are still very slim, but it’s better than 0.

    Anyways, I can say now that I’m on board with this idea involving game prizes as well. The only thing I don’t want involved are antiques and host items. Besides that, I’m alright with everything else. :)
    Definitely no antiques or host haha. and yay! I'm glad to hear your on board! I hope vfk makes it, it would give something to do after valentines is over. Vfk always gets slow this time of year; it would be the perfect add on for those slow days. Idk if I'd do all the work for the magics or game stuff; cause I'm lazy. LOL But i'd do the quest and scavenger option for sure!
  • edited February 10
    Hey everyone thanks for all the constructive feedback!

    @NiceCutePumpkin I agree, I think the building to the left of the Green Dragon tavern would be an ideal location, and having it open at night like @angelwaterfairy suggested would add a nice element of mystery, especially with Mr.Clutter shopkeeping.


    I also don't think anyone would object to someone getting retired items, provided they worked for them as hard as they might have to if they were going to trade for them!


    @MistyMew I think this quote sums up the thread perfectly! Thank you for this, and thank you for the backstory of Mr.Clutter and Esmeralda, I found it all very interesting. I can update the original post to say gypsy instead of ghost if you'd like, I was misinformed!


    I think this is a fantastic idea... and while this is being mentioned, I do recall VFK coming up with some kind of trading reward system a few years ago. It was something along the lines of... "if you traded for a certain retired item, you would get "points" (like the contest boutique) towards a new exclusive item"... I believe your method mentioned + the old mock up idea for this trading reward system would definitely bring back some of those full to the brim trade rooms that we all know, love, and miss!
    @I.Am.Chalk Yes I remember VFK announcing a concept like that, "The Ultimate Trader" or something along those lines -- I think the idea was not well received because it required players to obtain an older item to achieve a newer item. This would have put newer players at a disadvantage while rewarding older players, and would have caused certain retired items' values to temporarily inflate. This exchange would do just the opposite -- rewarding players with older items for newer items without putting anyone at a disadvantage, so I'm not surprised that this idea has been met with less resistance, since it would be a more inclusive feature.


    The concept is good. The execution however is another story. Would this really make trading great again? How about those who doesn't trade? Will it convert them to be traders or not since they can just get rarer or retired items without actually trading with another person? 

    I'm interested in the part how you said this will bring old players back in. I'm pretty sure most of them are still nostalgic about the older items but is there a way to contact the majority of them? Maybe staff can send a mass email for this? I also have so many questions regarding as how the VFK staff will make this happen. Will it affect the coding? Will it mess up the releasing system?

    Another question would be if they implemented this, how long will it run? Will it be seasonally like Antique Shop? You said destabilization won't be an issue but I want to know where you draw the line? There are hundreds of items they release in a year, how will the picking for this and that would go? I have more follow up questions about this but I'll stop right here.


    @GiftPrincess To address your first question, this concept will drive up demand for active releases. While some of us can run clones through quest/scavenger till the cows come home, not everyone has that kind of time, so busy people who want to exchange will have to trade for these active items. This means players who put in the time to run quests/hunts will be better compensated for their time, should they decide to hit the trade rooms afterward.

    In regards to your second question, about the select individuals who choose not to trade -- it's a personal choice and an individual's choice to refrain from trading would not change the fact that the demand for active releases would be higher overall. Perhaps they would return to the trade rooms if their active items were worth something, or if they got lucky in the exchange and received one of the rarer items, but if not, no harm done.

    Your third question asks about old players returning -- one of the reasons the antique shop is so popular with older players is because antiques trade so well, it offers them a chance at trading for rarer items. Since this exchange feature would offer the same perk, albeit more slowly, I think older players will naturally come back, since their time earning newer items would be worth more.

    Your final question asks how long it would run -- I don't see a problem with it running forever. As you mentioned, VFK releases hundreds of items each year, so the prize pools for each category would get larger and larger (which means a lower and lower probability of getting a specific item as time goes on). If VFK released the exchange today, by the time their 20th Anniversary hits, the probability of getting any individual prize prior to today would be reduced by a factor of two, and that probability is already extremely low. Active quest items will only be exchange-able on Sundays and Mondays (if VFK retires the quest on time), and scavenger hunt items only the 2-3 days the hunt is available. Since the window to exchange these items is so small, there will be many opportunities and players will need to be more active to catch a window. Also, keep in mind some scavenger hunt prizes are really nice (like these recent Valentine's Day pins). I can't see anyone trading in five of these pins for a shot at a random scavenger prize, so there will definitely be periods of time where the exchange is less active/desirable.

    I would love to hear any other questions and ideas you have Gift, especially as a newer player. You might be the only player I know who came from Miss Clue and plays VFK regularly. @Aceboy_Alex I also really liked your Oregon Trail idea


    I'm happy there's no host in it, however what about maze items?(both the small prizes such as the fences and the big prize) You can bulk up on those two and exchange for them. If they were left out intentionally I'd like to know; some people collect these though so I was curious.


    @prettyredstone Yes I left maze prizes out intentionally, primarily because it doesn't take any time or effort to stock up on them. It is very easy to leave a bunch of clones at the maze finish and click through them each hour for prizes. While maze prizes aren't worth much and there are a ton of different prizes in the prize pool, some prizes such as the Bubbling Cauldrons, Phantom Flame, Hay Wagons, etc. can trade for a lot, and I wouldn't want their value undermined by something that takes zero effort. If VFK excluded the special maze prizes, similar to how I asked them to exclude beta quest items, I think it would be a great feature! I don't think anyone would mind older maze walls coming back into circulation.


    @Perpetual_Fighter I'm glad you're on board! I apologize for not getting back to you sooner -- thanks Pumpkin for clearing up any confusion.  As someone with more game magics than any other player, I shared your same concern. I wouldn't want my collection that I have built up over the years to be rendered worthless overnight. However, given the amount of effort it takes to achieve 5 game prizes or game magics, I can't see the value of my hard-earned investments dropping any time soon, should VFK decide to implement this idea. Also, given that for each game magic release, another eight (sometimes more during Halloween) game prizes are added to the prize pool, the game prize pool is quite extensive and growing steadily with each release.

  • @Tomorrow I think having old walls would be a great idea. I agree with you on not putting in the bigger prizes due to values but oh man Id love to get some walls...
    art-starbucks 
  •  Wow, this is epic! I'd love to see this added! I've been playing for over a year, and I'm still trying to learn about VFK lol.
    Winking-Eye---Vi's-Gifs
  • NiceCutePumpkin said:

    Perpetual_Fighter said:

    NiceCutePumpkin said:

    Perpetual_Fighter said:

    It’s a clever idea, however I don’t think it’s wise to put retired items back in game. I think it would make trade value go down for certain items as they slowly, but surely, become more commonly found. (despite the argument that it wouldn’t, I politely disagree.)

    People work hard to trade for/ or earn in the past, retired items. I think that work would be invalidated by this system.

    This is only my opinion, and I don’t discredit your clever ideas. I do acknowledge it is a smart and cool concept, just not something I necessarily agree with.

    Quick additional note: I agree with Pumpkin on the aspect of this being a thing done with only quest/scavenger items. Game items sound fun too, but those can go for a lot (particularly the costumes and fx) and I wouldn’t want the value going down on those.

    If this were done only with quest and scavenger items, no host/game stuff, I’d be on board with the idea.

    I actually think that costumes and fx wouldn't be a bad idea at all. I was totally off on the idea at first too when Tom explained it to me because I said exactly what you said; especially with magics in particular. Because I don't want the value to go down.. but.. Something to keep in mind.. the number of items to exchange would be set at 5... and it's also only for CURRENT magics. So you can't go and exchange old magics that you just don't use. So for a current example.. I'd have to win 5 icicle magics just to be able to exchange anything. I usually can only win 2 magics before I'm losing my mind, personally lol. BUT.. I think because of the amount required - it's not like Everyone would be running out to exchange magics. I actually think it would help raise the price of the current magic. I currently won and icicle and sold it for 300k. If more people were looking for current magics because they wanted to exchange - it would bring more people out to game, and it would raise the price of current magics. Which I think need to be raised. 300k isn't enough for the hours spent gaming. But also... It's important to keep in mind that there's more magics than I can even mention... and those 2014-2015 years are so scarce. Your chances of winning one magic in particular is extremely slim. Because of the amount of work required to put in to win a magic.. there wouldn't be enough exchanges for it to have any effect. Tom, for example, has spent the past like, 2 years I believe? trying to find all of the game magics. It's a LOT harder than it should be because players have quit and people just don't have them. So for one magic in particular, let's say sniki-tiki cause I know he had trouble with that one, the odds of winning it are so slim... The amount released in a month probably wouldn't even exceed 5. The odds are just so small and the hard work for the magic limits the frequency and amount of people who would be doing the fx exchange.

    NOW.. haha; on the topic of game pieces and costumes. Another thing to mention; it takes 6 games ? I think, to win a magic. So that is only one exchange per game magic. So you make the exchange.. there are SO many game prizes out there. You can get a night fight chair, you can get raggedy ann shoes; endless possibilities. But it's only ONE piece. Not the entire costume. So again, because of the amount of hard work it takes to get current game prizes; the average person probably wouldn't exceed 1-2 exchanges in this category a month. I mean, when was the last time you gamed? I haven't played anything since.... uh I think last month lol. And I only won one game prize. I think it would be a lot different if we were to release the whole costume! But because the odds are so slim and you could literally get a skirt, which holds little value; it also really would have no effect on values. That was really the reasoning behind keeping it at 5. If it was a low number like only needing 2 then yea that would be ridiculous because people would be doing exchanges like mad. The amount of time it takes to win these prizes, makes it so you physically can't do as many exchanges as you might want to. It's just so tedious so, it's funny to because I'd probably be so mad if I spent all the time to win 5 game prizes.. only to exchange it for a night fighter chair. But that risk is a big part of this, which makes it fun!

    ALSO- Totally agree on the host thing, host should not be included in this. That for sure would mess up values and just get very confusing. But game prizes and fx I have no problem with due to the amount of work that's necessary.
    Sorry this was so long btw LOL. I just didn't wanna say it wrong and have you misinterpret. I think this could be a really great idea for vfk just to get items back out there, even if its only one or two. Our item count is so slim, fx especially. I don't know if it will have this Huge effect on vfk but it would be helpful and definitely give something to do on the slow weeks when we have no events.
    If you still disagree that's totally fine, I just figured I'd help explain a little because.. When tom first said it to me .. we basically went back and forth for a good 20
    minutes of me saying exactly what you just said lol.
    First and foremost, thank you so much for taking the time to explain this clearly and thoroughly. I appreciate the effort of mapping everything out in a concise manner. That being said, I have to say I am convinced. You’re right, that would make it pretty difficult to find a full costume or fx with other items involved in the draw like night fighter chairs lol. I am on the hunt for a couple night fighter bottles, so maybe this could be my chance to either trade for one or obtain one myself. Chances are still very slim, but it’s better than 0.

    Anyways, I can say now that I’m on board with this idea involving game prizes as well. The only thing I don’t want involved are antiques and host items. Besides that, I’m alright with everything else. :)
    Definitely no antiques or host haha. and yay! I'm glad to hear your on board! I hope vfk makes it, it would give something to do after valentines is over. Vfk always gets slow this time of year; it would be the perfect add on for those slow days. Idk if I'd do all the work for the magics or game stuff; cause I'm lazy. LOL But i'd do the quest and scavenger option for sure!
    Lol, I definitely feel you on that! I’m way too lazy to get one fx, let alone 5 to trade in. But I do love fx. I agree that vfk slows down a lot after holidays and this would be a great pass time for many. I hope they take it into consideration.
  • @Tomorrow No worries, it’s all good. Yes, this entire concept is a great idea and very fun to think about/entertain. It will keep players busy year-round, especially the collectors like myself.
  • edited February 12
    I approve and second any variation of these ideas in this thread, with the one caveat that nothing from 2008-2009 be re-released. Please consider this VFK! :D

    32cb878a
  • I support this idea. I think anything to try and boost the trading market would be a great advantage for us all. Even those that aren't traders would have a way to obtain things without actually trading they could at least exchange the item in hope's they would get something that they needed. 
  • This sounds really fun!
    skylambsignature
  • You've got my vote on this, literally the best idea since pins and fx got stacked in the inventory!!

    Give this some attention please!!
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